Having a 10000 watt or even 20000 watt whole house generator to power a house is the equivalent of having a semi truck in the driveway to pick up milk. Now that is when you have an inverter with a battery bank. Average power use in a big house is roughly 500Whr/ht to 1kWr/hr. You do need that huge generator for the start up load or to run large loads simultaneously. The dedicated loads electrical panel with the critical stuff on it is a better solution. I have a 4500 watt generator at home for charging up batteries in a long outage when the panels can't keep up. It would be powerful enough  to run the heat pump, furnace fan and water pump on its own. I would not run it continuously even if I had no battery back up as the idling fuel use would be too much. Idling is where those inverter generators come in handy as they can idle down to match the load on them while maintaining perfect power then ramp up fast when something bigger comes on. Usually an inverter generator is not ideal for battery charging since you are pushing it heavy the whole time so the fuel saving qualities are not used.

QuoteEquivalent of having a semi truck in the driveway to pick up milk.

That is how some people roll -  Or how Trumpers do prepping.


$2299.99 Was $2499.99 <- New lower price.  9500 Watts

The colors match.



None of these people are changing their lifestyle.  They just want to be cozy when the power goes out. 

Talking about batteries to them would be cognitive overload.

Quote from: 18hammers on Feb 16, 2024, 07:36 PMI know I am rolling in power again, fell asleep with the gaming computer running and woke up to still full batteries.

If you're interested in increasing your transportation resilience, you should look into buying one of the cheap mini EV scooters wiith enough range to do your local shopping and errands and see if your solar array has enough power to keep it juiced up for weekly shopping, bank, post office type trips.  You can pick one up for as little as $4000 or so.  Mine has a 40 mile range on a charge and top speed of 15 mph.  I use it to go food shopping at the superstore and drive it right inside the store aisles picking up my food, then back inside my building to my room to unload.

If you can swing $6-10K, you can get an enclosed mini car with a range of 80-120 miles that will do 35 mph.  Too big to actually drive inside a store though.



RE

Quote from: 18hammers on Feb 19, 2024, 10:17 PMThat electric car type is in my future, I am getting there in steps, already have electric bikes, Fat tire electric bikes for the gravel roads around me, have all the spare parts to keep them running. I have started building my own electric velomobile, but not like those flimsy fiberglass ones. Mine will be the velomobile equivalent of a 79 Lincoln continental in comfort. I have the rough frame done, a exact copy of a guy named Lothar from the bike forum's. Not his new design's but of the style he was building back in 2014/15 ish. I have the belly pan to add and a domed top, the top is the bubble canopy off a De Havilland Chipmonk. Not the British canopy, but the Canadian one as shown here,  https://www.vikingair.com/viking-aircraft/dhc-1-chipmunk.

I'd love to see the design, if you could do a drawing or schematic.  I don't see fiberglass as being flimsy, it's generally a lot lighter than working with sheet metal for the body, and unless you have really good metal working experience, it's quite difficult to make the complex curves to make it aerodynamically efficient.  I did some fiberglass boat building, and it's quite easy to get any shape you want out of it.  The strength comes from the frame and chassis underneath the fiberglass.  Steel bicycle tubing makes a great frame, although aluminum tubing saves a lot of weight.  Welding much easier with steel though.

When you start the build, make some how to videos!  I'll put them up on our YouTube channel. 

RE

Quote from: RE on Feb 17, 2024, 12:03 AMIf you can swing $6-10K, you can get an enclosed mini car with a range of 80-120 miles that will do 35 mph.  Too big to actually drive inside a store though.

RE

$8k. Had 35k miles on it at purchase, was a lease. Meets all the criteria of being cheap, indestructible and more than enough range in a suburban environment. Total runnings costs to date have been a rear window wiper blade, windshield washing fluid, and a set of tires.

Keep your Tesla's you suckling at the altar of Elon sychophants! I'll take a glorified golf cart with A/C, airbags and free electrons at work!

Quote from: TDoS on Feb 20, 2024, 08:17 PM$8k. Had 35k miles on it at purchase, was a lease. Meets all the criteria of being cheap, indestructible and more than enough range in a suburban environment. Total runnings costs to date have been a rear window wiper blade, windshield washing fluid, and a set of tires.

Keep your Tesla's you suckling at the altar of Elon sychophants! I'll take a glorified golf cart with A/C, airbags and free electrons at work!

Nice one.   Good choice.

RE

Quote from: RE on Feb 21, 2024, 01:59 AMNice one.   Good choice.
RE

For my area perhaps. Cold winters that reduce mile/kwh by -20%, but not that bad, but the traction control on electrics is awful. You get stuck pulling into your driveway if there is a little bit of snow slime there. So not optimal for any snow slick conditions. So perhaps REALLY not optimal for your clime. A 3 season car in Alaska probably.

Quote from: TDoS on Feb 21, 2024, 09:41 AM

Quote from: RE on Feb 21, 2024, 01:59 AMNice one.   Good choice.
RE

For my area perhaps. Cold winters that reduce mile/kwh by -20%, but not that bad, but the traction control on electrics is awful. You get stuck pulling into your driveway if there is a little bit of snow slime there. So not optimal for any snow slick conditions. So perhaps REALLY not optimal for your clime. A 3 season car in Alaska probably.

Not a very good choice here for sure, and the penetration so far as I have observed is not very good.  Cold weather battery performance also depends on how cold for how long it actually gets.  Typical winter temps in the lower 48 of 20-30F might give you -20%, but a month solid of sub-zero is another can of tuna entirely.  Heating the cabin while using the vehicle takes a shit load of the juice as well.  We also set a new snowfall record this year, so performance on slippery roads is a big factor.

"3 season" also gives false impression that it would be good 3/4 of the year, but winter conditions exist here in fall and spring as well.  Nov-Mar can all be ugly, so it's almost 1/2 the year it's not a great choice of vehicles.

I doubt they will ever make much sense up here, unless you can afford both types.

RE

Quote from: K-Dog on Jan 22, 2024, 10:57 AMPeople do not believe in anything unless they have a reason.  And when they want something bad enough the reasons they find depart from reality.

It sounds as though you have just provided the causal mechanism for all the peak oil claims of the early 21st century. Bravo Sir!

Quote from: TDoS on Feb 24, 2024, 04:09 PM

Quote from: K-Dog on Jan 22, 2024, 10:57 AMPeople do not believe in anything unless they have a reason.  And when they want something bad enough the reasons they find depart from reality.

It sounds as though you have just provided the causal mechanism for all the peak oil claims of the early 21st century. Bravo Sir!

I can agree with you.  But claims go both ways.  So which is easier to find?  Someone who says the world is getting warmer because that is what the world wants to do, with nothing to do with humans.  And that wee have oil enough for 500 years.  Or someone who says this shit is going to be so hard to get in twenty years that our society must collapse and people will starve.

Which is the more popular delusion?  If you are having trouble.  I suggest door number one.

M. King Hubbert however is in a class by himself.  He was the leading American geologist.  He also was not wrong.  What blew most peak oil claims up is that the proponents were too attached to a single peak.  They were enamored with the simplicity and did not look deeper.  The truth is that the amount which can be extracted has increased with advancement of technology and the state of the art.  This moves the peak but does not turn the idea of peak oil into bullshit.  Reality actually suggests the ride down the peak will resemble a Seneca cliff.  When the state of the art is lost it does not come back.

A doomer with a scientific bent, and that fully describes me, realizes that things are working out exactly as we thought they would twenty-five years ago.  The timeline is working out different, and that is all.  That does not mean much to me.  Just because people can't predict exactly when something is going to happen does not mean it will not happen.  Collapse happens like the Iceland volcanoes erupt.  You will drive yourself crazy following 'predictions' of eruptions which are sure to happen.  Check every day, and after a few weeks of no eruption you will think the volcano will not erupt.  You have sour grapes.  Then the volcano erupts  Like it did twice last year. 

So it is with collapse.

OK Doomsteaders with Solar PV setups here (NH & 18H), there is now a new "Ultimate" system addition you need to make your setup 100% self-suffient on an annual basis.  In addition to your batts, you need to install an eloctrolyser, compressor, storage tanks for H₂ and a H₂ fuel cell for your LDES seasonal differential.



Bonus here is you can also run your tractor and pickup truck on the hydrogen as well with an ICE that takes H, which I think one that uses wood gas would work with minor modifications. Together with your low power mini EV car or trike scooter, you'll have your transportation needs covered as well as home power needs.

Besides the fuel cell all the rest of the equipment you can put together DIY from off the shelf components available at Home Depot.  For the fuel cell generator, I have found models for around $2500 selling on alibaba, and I think you could do even better than that.



Be the first on your block to have the Full Monte of Juice Independence!

https://www.pv-magazine.com/2024/05/01/new-approach-shows-how-to-power-homes-eclusively-with-hydrogen-solar-and-batteries/

New model shows how to power homes exclusively with hydrogen, solar, batteries

RE

The truth about hydrogen has been known for quite a while.  But.............

Quote from: K-Dog on May 07, 2024, 01:15 AMThe truth about hydrogen has been known for quite a while.  But.............

Definitely it has its deficiencies.  Vehicles will need to be designed with much larger fuel tanks and will have less range and performance.  The H-ICE variation really is only useful for heavy equipment where you need the torque.  In automobiles, going electric with a fuel cell makes much more sense.  As a fuel for aviation it looks close to useless, except of course if Hindenburgh-phobia can be overcome and we bring back dirigibles. 

However, IF enough of the necessary infrastructure could be built for the distribution and IF enough renewable energy production facilities making Green Hydrogen came online and IF enough affordable cars running either on traditional Li-I batts or H fuel cells could be built by say 2050,  then there is a SLIM hope that we can keep the dieoff down to maybe just 50% of the population rather than 95% and have a technofuturistic utopia instead of becoming stone age hunter gatherers after the collapse. 

Think positive!

RE

Quote from: RE on May 07, 2024, 06:18 AM

Quote from: K-Dog on May 07, 2024, 01:15 AMThe truth about hydrogen has been known for quite a while.  But.............

Definitely it has its deficiencies.  Vehicles will need to be designed with much larger fuel tanks and will have less range and performance.  The H-ICE variation really is only useful for heavy equipment where you need the torque.  In automobiles, going electric with a fuel cell makes much more sense.  As a fuel for aviation it looks close to useless, except of course if Hindenburgh-phobia can be overcome and we bring back dirigibles. 

However, IF enough of the necessary infrastructure could be built for the distribution and IF enough renewable energy production facilities making Green Hydrogen came online and IF enough affordable cars running either on traditional Li-I batts or H fuel cells could be built by say 2050,  then there is a SLIM hope that we can keep the dieoff down to maybe just 50% of the population rather than 95% and have a technofuturistic utopia instead of becoming stone age hunter gatherers after the collapse. 

Think positive!

RE

Think positive??  You still have not figured out where you are going to get the free juice for making hydrogen.  And when you find your free energy source remember 20% of your power is lost in conversion.  50% if you make it yourself.  But that won't matter because you found free energy.

Robots who mine asteroids for metals can bring some hydrogen back from space too.  The sun is made of it.  A big  spaceship can land on the sun and get some.  We can call her the Solar Express.


Wherever you find your energy source you can use the empty space to sequester CO2.  It the math equations don't balance take psychedelics until it does not matter, when 2 + 2 = 5 you will be in the sweet spot.

And if you solve the technical problems and have your holy dispensation to violate the laws of the universe, inquiring minds would like to know how capitalism which is only a reactionary political force that responds to 'markets' can do the mojo.  Capitalism is incapable of pulling itself up by its bootstraps to create a market where one does not exist.

I suppose the conventional way of developing all this on the public dime, and then giving it to a billionaire for a song or for free. (Russian oligarch style.) could do it.

Hydrogen is a thought-stopper.  Hydrogen tech exists so you don't pay attention and for no other reason.  I say that with confidence because Hydrogen is only a transport mechanism like the wires on a power pole.  Hydrogen is not a source of energy.  You cannot make an energy source because it always takes more energy to make an energy source than you get from using it.  This is a law of the universe and you can't dance around it.

You have to find pure hydrogen for it to be an energy source.  The nearest source of hydrogen is 93 million miles away down a deep gravity well.  Imagining hydrogen as the power of the future is every bit as deluded as thinking you can collect the CO2 in the air and turn it back into gasoline.

Clean CO2, the power of the future.

Scientists at Dreamland University have found a way to turn CO2 in the atmosphere into methane.  This makes CO2 the new freedom molecule.  How is this done?  Professor John Legpuller and his team have ...

Same equation different numbers.

Quote from: K-Dog on May 07, 2024, 09:40 AMYou still have not figured out where you are going to get the free juice for making hydrogen.

From all those wind farms, solar pv farms, hydro plants, tidal generators, geothermal plants & micro nukes they have on the drawing boards.

RE