Quote from: RE on Sep 13, 2023, 12:25 AM

Quote from: 18hammers on Sep 12, 2023, 08:08 PMYes, I have been thinking of making the jump to 24 volt. So many issues though, I have and I kid you not at least 6 great inverters I have picked up dirt cheap over the years, I have heavy duty 12 volt chargers, multiple. I would have to wind a new stator for the wind turbine. It is hard to make changes when things are mostly working fine but I suspect the jump to 24volts may be in the future or I am thinking about having both a 12 volt and 24 volt and just switch between them as needed. I don't know what I am going to do.

It's always difficult to make a change to a superior technology when you have invested a whole lot of money in an older tech and the hardware still works.  Think of all the big companies that had tons invested in IBM Mainframe technology when the Desktop computers hit the scene.  They were much slower at changing over their systems than newer and/or smaller ones that had never invested so much.  Besides the hardware, all the software they had custom written for their own systems also became obsolete as newer better software was developed for desktops and mass marketed, coming in at a fraction of the price of their custom packages, which also had to be individually maintained and upgraded.  Eventually of course they did switchover except for a few applications better suited to mainframe supercomputers.Another current example is trying to build all new Charging Stations for EV carz when there are tons of already built and still functional gas pumps which are going obsolete.

Is it worth the money to make the changeover from 12V to 24V?  You have to do a Cost-Benefit analysis.  For your own application, how much added efficiency do you really need now?  How much will switching benefit you in the future?  I would say as long as 12V does the job you need done and you can still maintain it in the future, it doesn't make economic sense to switch.  This is an individual decision for everyone, there's no single answer.

RE

it is a hard decision one I again have to make. I currently have a 24 volt system and am debating upgrading to 48 volts. I'm taking down the existing and reinstalling and the breaker and cabling costs will be high to do a legal system. So do I install everything I already have for charge controllers or up the voltage and install half as many at 48 volts... There is a cost to trade in and upgrade my inverter but probably less than the costs of twice as many breakers and cables and time...

Quote from: 18hammers on Sep 26, 2023, 05:42 PMBeen thinking more about the jump to 24 volts. Decided to do it, next year sometime. Been running single phase, mod sine,  just fine all these years but now thinking I may as well go spit phase and sine, in for a penny, in for a pound as they say. 

Do you mean single phase 110/240? Split phase is pretty uncommon. What inverter are you currently running?

Quote from: 18hammers on Sep 27, 2023, 07:36 PM

Quote from: Nearings Fault on Sep 27, 2023, 12:30 PM

Quote from: 18hammers on Sep 26, 2023, 05:42 PMBeen thinking more about the jump to 24 volts. Decided to do it, next year sometime. Been running single phase, mod sine,  just fine all these years but now thinking I may as well go spit phase and sine, in for a penny, in for a pound as they say. 

Do you mean single phase 110/240? Split phase is pretty uncommon. What inverter are you currently running?

I am currently running a used TRIPP LITE PV2000FC 2000W, cost me all of 50 bucks of kijiji. Split phase is what most the inverters I see on line advertise them as, if they output 120/240

ok, we are talking about the same thing then. You don't see many tripp lites around. If you want the same kind of durability the magnum PAE is probably your best bet. It uses the iron core copper wrapped transformer common in low frequency inverters. It's nice because it does not have a heavy standby draw and is a well established unit, comes in 24 and 48 volts models. The newer high frequency units have done away with the core but their standby draw is higher. Their surge capacity is also not as good. In that realm would be the Sol Ark at the high end and the SRNA and growatt at the lower end. They are nice in that they incorporate the high voltage charge controllers but anything goes wrong with them and they are a brick... I just designed a system with a growatt in it. For the cost you can have a second one waiting on the shelf in case of problems. The growatt is not split phase but SRNA has one. And auto transformer is also an option.

Quote from: 18hammers on Oct 21, 2023, 10:18 AMThe shorter days of winter are here now, snow in the forecast for Monday, overnight lows going into double digit negatives.

That's getting into the Parka territory.  We're still at Sweatshirt weather here around 35F.  Sunny today also.  How about inside the house?  What temperature do you keep it at?  How many layers do you wear inside?

RE

QuoteUp stairs will be anywhere from 5 to 15C depending on day or night.

You do serious hibernation.  I hope you have chocolate.

Quote from: 18hammers on Oct 21, 2023, 04:36 PMFor winter I move into my curtained off area down stairs, 9 x 18feet =162 sqft area. the diesel heater just heats this area to 20-22C.

That's too warm for me.  Prior to being relocated to the SNIF while in my own digs, I kept my thermostatatt about 15C.  I wore 2-3 layers indoors, thermal long johns, sweatpants and crew neck sweatshirt, adding a hoodie sweatshirt with no liner if I felt cold.  To go outside to smoke a cancerette, I added another lined hoodie.  I had an electric space heater under my desk if it was -10F or less outside and cold air would bleed in under the front and back doors.  Turn it on every so often to warm my toes.

RE

Quote from: 18hammers on Dec 25, 2023, 07:27 PMI think the 21st was the shortest day of the year, and the last 5 or so days have been mostly sunny, have not needed to run the generator at all. I seem to get my needed 6 kwh a day of sun. I know that can change in a instant but the 14 day forecast looks good. Very mild temps, not even burning wood, getting above 0c most days. I was out watering my Cedar's the other day. Mostly a brown Christmas here (spots of snow). 

The 21st was the shortest day, that caught me by surprise. Times flies.  Every year seems shorter.

Quote from: K-Dog on Dec 26, 2023, 12:01 AM

Quote from: 18hammers on Dec 25, 2023, 07:27 PMI think the 21st was the shortest day of the year, and the last 5 or so days have been mostly sunny, have not needed to run the generator at all. I seem to get my needed 6 kwh a day of sun. I know that can change in a instant but the 14 day forecast looks good. Very mild temps, not even burning wood, getting above 0c most days. I was out watering my Cedar's the other day. Mostly a brown Christmas here (spots of snow). 

The 21st was the shortest day, that caught me by surprise. Times flies.  Every year seems shorter.

Every day is shorter, as a percentage of the total number of days you have been alive.  Seems insignificant, but if you think of years when you were a kid, a year seemed like a very long time.  At 10, another year was 10% of your lifetime.  At 50, another year is just 2%.

When I was a kid in the 70s watching TV shows made in the 50s, stuff like Leave it to Beaver seemed like ancient history.  Now in 2023, 2003 seems like yesterday.

Age changes your perception of time.

RE

No doubt age changes perception. 

It also does not seem cold enough to be this late in the year.  By now an endless rain of winter should be upon Seattle.  But today it is 44 degrees and sunny.  This is not the same Seattle I moved from Minneapolis to almost fifty years ago.  For decades the pattern was clear.  Endless rain with a couple or three weeks of snow in midwinter.  Very predictable, but things are much more random now.  I think it has been below freezing twice.  It has been cold, but not freezing.

We live in different times and it is not just the weather.

In the 70's the 50's seemed like ancient history.  Now old times are marketed $$$ so thoroughly that twenty years ago does seem like yesterday.  If in the 1970's old farts from the 1920's were still pushing old music it would have been weird.  Not so now.

Society ossified.  But nobody told me.  Social contradictions baked in the cake by cheap energy are tolerated by the satisfaction of general need.  Inequities hidden by human tribalism which ignores those who are out-group, flourish.

Money found a sweet spot and locked us down.

Well, it's true that life changed much more from 1920 to 1970 than from 1970 to 2020.  The inventions and applications of eneergy came fast and furious through the early part of the 20th century, the 2nd half was mainly expansion and refinement of those technologies. Few had cars in 1920, by 1970 they were indispensible.  Cars are still cars though, and you still can drive a 1970 Ford Mustamg around and be cool.  You couldn't drive a Model T in 1970 and be cool though.

Music changed with electrification of the Gibson Guitar in the 1950s, bringing on Rock n Roll.  Everything before was instantly obsolete.  A few AM radio stations still played Frank Sinatra and he still played in Vegas, but it was fuddy duddy music.  Today you can tune in the Rolling Stones on any Classic Rock station in the country and it sounds fine.

The only real significant difference between now and 1970 is computers and social media.  That has changed the social dynamic significantly.

RE

If the city has a power outage the store quickly sells out of generators.  The premium generator we sell puts out about 10,000 watts.  A customer told me "that is enough to power a house".  I looked at him and said to myself.  He has several daughters.

It takes two people to move that puppy.  Tesla land has big houses.  Some residents might need two generators.

As far north as you are I am amazed you can get off gas so quick.

You don't need 10Kw to power a house.  3Kw is enough.

RE

Quote from: RE on Jan 22, 2024, 06:32 AMYou don't need 10Kw to power a house.  3Kw is enough.

RE

You forget where I live.  People here do not believe in climate change.  There is a reason.  They have money.  I called it Tesla Land for a reason.

With a heat pump I would need a large size too.

People do not believe in anything unless they have a reason.  And when they want something bad enough the reasons they find depart from reality.

Yea, if you're doing home heating and cooling and cooking and charging a car with electricity, you need a lot more than 3Kw.  I would just buy an emergency propane or kerosene heater and camping stove.  Electricity just for lights, computer and refrigerator.

RE

You would, but the burbs will be buying generators.  It won't be just the Lake Mead area that will be having power interruptions.  Remember the brouhaha when John Denver tried to put in his own underground gas storage tank?

Ahead there will be no such outcry in the new wild west.  And life is good for the generator companies.


As you can see, the recent increase in level is part of normal fluctuation, and in Las Vegas the house always wins over time.  The house being mother nature here.  She rolls the dice every day.  The overall trend is clear.  The law of large numbers will kick in.  Mother natures'  house we can't leave, so she has the time.